I'm always hearing how the nice guy never 'gets' the girl. I understand why this appears to be so. I've gone out with both the creeps and the nice guys.
In my life experience the nice guys have also been the creeps; they were just appearing to be nice, cause that's how they got by in the world. They're known as 'good old such and such', everyone likes them. And this is how they get away with being manipulative and controlling.
I chose to go out with (and then m-m-m... really commit to) a particular 'nice guy' particularly because he was a 'nice guy'. (Really he was not nice, more of a con man because he was actually heartless and controlling. See? Creep!) But, I thought I was being smart. I wasn't going to make that mistake again of going for the other type, the tougher or meaner guy. Of course, I thought they were nice too at first, but I was aware they had other sides to them too. Rough around the edges. Sometimes these rough edges were exciting. So I suppose it could be true that we often see 'the nice guy' as bland or dull...?
Many women don't think enough of themselves to be with a truly nice guy. We often have such a low opinion of ourselves that it would be just plain crazy to be with a guy who sincerely thinks we're great and of value. He must be nuts to look at us as special! What's wrong with him!!? So, this is often why we end up with the less-than-nice guy. He will perhaps say nice things to us - and we all want that - but really he knows our worth is less than his. We know our place and he does too.
In addition to, or instead of this, I think we pick the not-so-great guy because, well, us ladies are nurturers. We might see a guy's flaws but instead of thinking, 'Oh, this guy really needs to work on himself before he's any good for a relationship. He can't take care of himself at all. He. has. got. issues!'... We will instead think: 'Oh, isn't he sweet? He can't even take care of himself! What the poor love must have gone through... what pain he must be in! He needs my love... etc, etc.)'
Why do we do this? Again, I'm guessing it's cause we feel it gives us some worth, we feel needed. We are useful. And we are most useful of course, to the guys who are the biggest wrecks. (Of course these guys just lap it up, let us do all the work in the relationship and they never 'evolve' or 'heal' - instead it's the girl who begins to fall in a hole. And! Then! the nice guys look at this and think, 'Why is she wasting herself on that piece of shit?! I would never treat her like that!! etc, etc.')
Another reason we may go for the creep (who obviously has a heart of gold under there somewhere, he just need us to help him find it...) is because he may appear to be more exciting and/or more interesting.
Of course, all of this can come under the heading: Women who have been messed up by Daddy. Fathers have a massive impact on their daughters. Once I understood this, so much of my own 'stuff' became clearer.
What I'm saying is we find guys like 'daddy', men who will treat us as poorly as our fathers did. Firstly because that is what we know, is all we know of men, so anything else doesn't really turn-up on our radar. Secondly it's because by (unconsciously) putting ourselves through the same shit again we eventually learn how to get ourselves out of it. [Eg. one of my issues with my father is that he neglected me, he wasn't 'present' in the relationship, so I've found men (even when deliberately picking 'the nice guy'!) who will also ignore me and are not present in the relationship; so by going through that over and over I eventually learn that I deserve better and see that just because 'daddy' neglected me doesn't mean I am worthy of neglect, and learn to develop self-worth, etc, yadda, yadda, yadda, blah, blah, blah...]
I've been thinking that, apart from the above (which everyone already knows), some nice guys perhaps are often less attractive to women because we sense they don't have a richness of spirit. Yeah, some guys are just plain shallow and dumb. That makes sense. No, not just that, what I'm getting at is that maybe we sense there isn't enough depth to some of these men. And this is important because us wonderful women, complex creatures that we are, want someone who will dare to take the time and make the effort to delve into and understand our depths, our complex nature.
This surely sounds dumb to many of you and maybe I'm not putting it very well, but I'm learning more lately about the nature of women. We have more than one side to us. We don't want to be understood merely on our social or shallow level; at face value only. We want a partner to be unafraid to see our darker side; to dare to peer into our inner world.
Of course many women, with some dark and sad issues still to deal with, would also want to avoid this type of man cause she may be fearing these aspects of herself and doesn't want to be with someone who might see them.
But still, I like this idea cause I think it can go both ways (see, now you're getting excited!). It's more about people being ready to really get to know someone else in a relationship. To be profound enough in their own life, understanding their self and selves, so that they can dare to see these darker or deeper sides of someone else.
So, maybe it's not about whether a guy is nice or not. Maybe it's just waiting for the person - this goes for men and women - who has delved through their own issues, their own shit, and got their act together enough that they're not afraid to delve into the depths of their own nature. And by being open to their own complexities they are willing to make the effort to see and understand someone else's. To dare to know someone's true nature; even with all its wildness and paradoxes. It can be scary and take some time and effort. Most of us can't be bothered with that or are too frightened.
Anyway, I've rambled on enough. I guess nice guys just have to understand that a lot of us lasses are too down on ourselves to accept someone who values them. And us lasses have to understand that a lot of guys are too messed up to be good for us, or beyond 'saving'.
So, in between, must be the souls that have done their hard work and sorted themselves out enough to be ready to really have a relationship. I suppose it needs two such people to come together for a deeper and profound connection to take place. By then we should have learnt enough about our own flaws and how to accept them, so that we can do that for someone else. ...Learned to accept that we are complex creatures but worth understanding, so that we can then do that for someone else. And on and on, etc.
Well, anyway, I want someone who is a - genuinely - nice guy but who also has great courage and depth too. And to be damn interesting! Some nice guys only have one side to them. I want to see all sides, and I want him to even know about all his sides. And I want him to be interested enough in me to take the time to get to know all of my complexities too, my wilder sides and all that. (And I'm hoping I won't settle for anything less.)
Jeez, that makes sense doesn't it?
[/end mushy ravings]
I know the answer! The answer lies within the heart of all mankind! The answer is twelve? I think I'm in the wrong building. - Charles M. Schulz